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Ad Nausica's avatar

I just don't get it. I really don't. Why is everybody acting as if there are only two positions here; either you support vaccine mandates or you are an anti-vaxxer who puts everybody's children at risk.

Has nobody actually ever read the vaccine approvals, or the monographs, or understands how science works, or how risk management works, or checked the risk mitigation plan for the vaccines?

Let's start with the "won't somebody think of the children" aspect. According to GoC Epidemiological Update, as of Aug 27, 2021, page 25, the total number of deaths for people aged 0-19 is 16 people in over 18 months, or about a rate of 10 per year. https://health-infobase.canada.ca/src/data/covidLive/Epidemiological-summary-of-COVID-19-cases-in-Canada-Canada.ca.pdf

By way of comparison, several hundred are killed per year in car accidents and 50-60 die by drowning. Hospitalizations show similar comparison rates.

Or even in adults. What is the probability and size of harm to a vaccinated person from a random unvaccinated person, especially if the unvaccinated person has been screened by other methods? How does it compare to other regular risks we accept?

Heck, the literature strongly suggests that prior COVID-19 patients have much stronger immunity and duration than the vaccines. They are less of a risk, even unvaccinated, than a vaccinated person. Yet we treat them like they are high risk?

OK, but wouldn't it be better to vaccinate them anyway, to eliminate those 10 or so? What's the harm? Read the damn monographs. E.g., Moderna monograph, Section 7.1:

https://covid-vaccine.canada.ca/info/pdf/covid-19-vaccine-moderna-pm-en.pdf#page=8

"The safety and efficacy of COVID-19 Vaccine Moderna in pregnant women have not yet been

established. ... It is unknown if COVID-19 Vaccine Moderna is excreted in human milk. A risk to the newborns/ infants cannot be excluded."

Or the approvals, e.g., Moderna: https://covid-vaccine.canada.ca/info/regulatory-decision-summary-detailTwo.html?linkID=RDS00736

"One limitation of the data at this time is the lack of information on the long-term safety and efficacy of the vaccine. The identified limitations are managed through labelling and the Risk Management Plan. The Phase 3 Study is ongoing and will continue to collect information on the long-term safety and efficacy of the vaccine.”

Labeling means the risk is managed by informed consent of the patient. It diversifies the risk. The Risk Management Plan monitors outcomes after the fact and updates the monographs, so that future vaccinators can make up-to-date informed consent to take the risk.

Trudeau is eliminating all risk mitigation completely. He is confusing absence of evidence of harm with evidence of absence of harm. He is confusing the overall approval risk-benefit tradeoffs so that people *can* take the vaccines with the individual case-by-case risk-benefit calculations in which they decide if they *should* take the vaccines.

These are classic errors in risk management that brought down two space shuttles, heavily contributed to Chernobyl, and caused the Thalidomide tragedy, except in the U.S. where Canadian Frances Kelsey withheld approval because the absence of evidence of harms, and even some evidence of absence of harms in rats, was not enough and she required long-term safety testing. She saved many American babies. Sadly, Canada approved Thalidomide in 1961.

I haven't even touched on rights, or alternative methods for comparison, of which there are many issues. There's also the underlying Trolley problem in moral philosophy of putting younger people at potentially longer risk with less benefit, all to save older people. There's also a game theoretic Prisoners Dilemma social game here that remains undiscussed.

And, I'm double-vaccinate and recommend them to almost everybody. But I also recognize that we're all taking a chance here, and there is significant risk mitigation value in allowing people to decide for themselves.

I don't get why the press doesn't actually read the approvals and monographs, or understand the unknown long-term risks, or the short-term risks, and doesn't do the math or propose alternative solutions.

For example, a young woman with prior COVID infection and immunity, working remotely in an are with low count, may well be better off to go last; meaning wait until everybody else gets vaccinated and wait until more data comes in. There doesn't seem to be any net benefit to her and it's all risk.

So many highly intellectual and professional reasons to object, and yet even critics in the media, like here, just focus on it being stupid people and whether or not they have the right to be stupid.

I'm disappointed in the press as a whole here. And politicians. Do better jobs. Read and understand the materials. Understand how risk works, and how to mitigate it. Do the math. Stop being lazy and single-minded.

Read more here: https://adnausica.substack.com/p/a-canadian-behavioral-study-of-obedience

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Mark Ch's avatar

I replied to this post with the following email:

Thank you for posting this, specifically the part about vaccine mandates. I have now become a paying subscriber on account of it.

While I disagree with you in part (there is pretty compelling evidence that people who have already recovered from Covid do not benefit themselves or society from then getting vaccinated, which would also expose them to risk from non-trivial side effects), this disagreement pales in comparison to the points on which we agree. I see these as being that people have a fundamental right in a free society to non-violently protest; and that these vaccine mandates are in fact a massive infringement on people's freedom and personal autonomy, to which people can legitimately object. I notice that you don't come right out and say that this infringement is actually unjustified, but the way you describe the mandates makes it clear that you don't support them, and that you are uncomfortable with the Liberal campaign's attempts to whip up and benefit from anger or hatred against the unvaccinated.

The most important thing of all is that you see the unvaccinated as fellow humans and fellow Canadians who have some rights and deserve not to be unreasonably vilified and oppressed. That in itself sets you apart from most journalists (and quite possibly Canadians) right now, and is enough to make me want to support you and consider you a friend.

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