She's completely right. Wind farms are totally uneconomic, and it's much more difficult to export electricity than data.
While data centres are overbuilt right now, they aren't going away. With oil and gas exports impeded by excessive regulation, something that can benefit from cheap energy and be exported with optical fibre is just the thing.
If Newfoundland had had data centres, the Churchill Falls electricity discussion would look very different.
Danielle Smith is living in 1950. Oil and gas are not the future. Fresh water is going to be a crisis sooner than later. Renewable energy is the future. She's worried about the view, but wants coal mines on the eastern slopes. Pick a lane. Who would invest in a new pipeline when independence might scuttle its construction? Who would drop a cent into Alberta right now, when a collection of backwards-thinking fools are whining that being the richest province in the country isn't enough, and think they should go it alone? And then they think the bible-thumpers in the US will treat them better? Naive is an understatement. And that's after 40 years of court cases to see who gets what in the breakup. Blackmail is rarely a good idea. Alberta is going backwards at full speed.
Energy is prosperity, it’s not going anywhere. If you don’t want Canadian energy, where companies have made amazing changes to reduce and even eliminate their impact on the environment, that energy will have to come from somewhere else. You may not like where that is. Alberta takes its responsibilities seriously no matter what you’ve heard wherever you are. You also can’t run an economy on renewables, that isn’t possible at this time if ever.
As to the data centres, that genie isn’t going back into the bottle. The pearl clutching needs to stop. What we need is less opinion and more information so we can take informed decisions.
Fossil fuel burning is also the death of humanity. And there are ways to have energy that don't destroy the planet. China is leading on that. The rest of the world is daily proving that you can run an economy on renewables. Solar in the Sahara could power Europe. We could be leading, but backwards thinking, like Danielle's, looks at today and ignores tomorrow. There is no future for Danielle's grandchildren.
IMHO, data centres are like social media. We did a hell of a lot better without them. AI could be fabulous, but humanity will fuck it up...as it's already doing. I have yet to hear a single case as to why data centres are critical to anything. That they are destroying communities and the environment while feeding wealth to oligarchs is beyond doubt.
What are you talking about, Data centres are the future and Alberta has abundant Natural Gas to fuel them. This is a win win, using a product internally, that the rest of Canada wants us to abandon to energize the future which is AI data centres.
Future of what? We need RI far more than AI. How are you going to cool them? Hell, you could power them with solar farms with a little forethought, but that won't be happening, it appears.
Are you insane, do you have ANY idea how much energy is required for AI to work, Solar will never be able to meet that demand, it would be equivalent to using Dial up internet! Since you appear to be a climate catastrophist and clearly dont understand the physics of energy I dont feel the need to further engage.
You might want to take a quick peek at just how much land you would need to cover with solar arrays to provide the energy requirements of a high density data centre.... plus of course, all the batteries one would require to provide power the OTHER two thirds of the time (when the sun isn't shining)
I see this all the time. Why does everything have to become a tool for Whataboutery? Why can't you just take the win - especially when wins are rare - and feel good about it? This is literally like a kid getting an A in math being scolded for not getting an A in everything else. Why can't people just celebrate the damn win? What's wrong if Alberta becomes a powerhouse in Data centers infrastructure? Just please stop with the Whataboutery especially when you have a concrete win to point to.
I’m more optimistic. You’re dealing with free enterprisers who have their shareholders’ money at stake rather than pusillanimous pearl clutching civil servants and politicians worried about suburban Karens’ reaction to any impact on property values.
I don’t like wind farms and they done make sense in AB.
I’m upset about Smith unilaterally changing Alberta to central standard time after the province voted against it. It’s caused a ton of scheduling issues for me that I’m going to have to deal with repeatedly and that’s ignoring the fact that we will all be living with a clock that isn’t aligned with the actual light signals that we get from the sun. BC is in the same boat pretending they’re in mountain standard time. People won’t realize how much of a pain it is until it happens and they have to change their entire calendars if they work with people in other time zones. All the sudden a 9-5 calendar will become a 10-6 calendar for part of the year which messes with family routines. And meanwhile we’ll be waking up in the dark and still finishing work in the dark. Less daylight to see for everyone who works in an office. It’s really bad and I’m surprised there’s not more people talking about it.
They should’ve at least been honest and said they were moving Bc to mountain standard and Alberta to central standard time year round. Instead of these hogwash “staying in bc daylight and mountain daylight” nonsense.
And, thank goodness for that! Wind farms are a drain on our economics, Data centres will be a boost to us economically. I would hazard a guess that long term the data centres are better for the environment than the wind farms as well. All, Data centers are the future whether we like it or not, and canada is very well positioned to capitalize on the financial opportunities they represent just based on our northern geographic location.
I don’t know tons about data centres but I do know a lot of people have a lot of opinions, informed or not, about them.
Alberta is well situated to accommodate many of them, we certainly have the energy to power them, we have the land mass on which to build them, all we need is information and actual knowledge about them to allay the fears.
The politics aside, I doubt the Alberta Data centre, and a good many others, will ever be completed. This is a repeat of the dot-com boom or the rail bust of the 1920s. Massive overbuilding of infrastructure that cannot be sustained by the demand and revenue it requires. (It is only this year that some companies' stock prices returned to what they were 26 years ago.
This time, I suspect it will be much worse than previous events, more money, more companies
The part of the discussion that seems to be missed is that little of the production of the equipment for windmills, solar panels nor data centres will occur in North America, let alone Canada or Alberta. The vast majority of the capital equipment spend will be in Asia or Europe.
While the output of renewable energy can be measured, and presumably levies charged by governments, I am curious as to how it is, beyond initial construction, a few operations jobs and property taxes, that data centres will contribute to a local or regional economy?
And when they inevitably wear out is the a replacement or refurbishment requirement, or do they become the abandoned eyesores of the 2070s?
Most assured,they’ll be eyesores. Recently have been travelling by truck across Alberta,Northwards. Section after section after section of land has been cleared of trees. Sawmills,OSB mills ect. So much is being left bare. I’ve walked these sections and not one tree has been replanted,even after 5-10 years since logging. I guess it all looks ok for the government employees from their office screens. Who inspects and insures that the work is complete? Gravel pits? Old oil and gas wells?
Please do not ignore relevant public - read voter - experience. Realizing that renewables can't produce during severe winter weather made a deep impression on voters. Hence, there is subsequent support for limiting renewable because voters need a stable grid that is not a patch up. Recent experience trumps words from various causes, past or present.
Meanwhile, the data centre plans came at a time when the media was stoking worry that AI will reduce good paying jobs and use too much water. The left grasped those straws, attempting to make political hay.
The modern data centres planned for Alberta use closed loop cooling systems and also use air from Alberta's cold winters. Those 2 options were not available to last decade's data centres in places like Arizona, from which the media and the left are drawing information.
The UCP did a poor communications job of the roll out - one wonders if they bothered to do polls - and is now in catch up mode. But there's a lot of positives related to data centres, including long term well paying jobs. Data centre location issues are fixable. The data centres are building their own electricity plants. I can't wait to see how this situation pans out.
Renewable energy sources do not pay government any royalties even though currently oil royalties are paid in bitumin not dollars. Nice for the oil companies and a pathetic payback for the province getting its own natural resources back as payment. Somehow support for oil has been propogandized into loyalty to Alberta and breaking that ideological roadblock isn't easy
I'm coming late, but I remember Matt Gurney talking nearly a year ago about a loss of subject matter experts in the news industry (this was in response to a Jason Kenney tweet, which was in response to a CTV news article talking about S.33 that was very poorly researched). In that same way, I am begging Rob Breakenridge to actually TALK to industry about renewables in Alberta, instead of regurgitating the same thing repeated by multiple writers before him or getting information from Pembina Institute. The province installed about 75% of renewables in the entire country from 2020 to 2026, and now the big bottleneck is that Alberta needs to actually be able to hook projects onto the grid. Big electrical infrastructure is at a huge bottleneck and years-long wait times.
Unironically, data centres would help spur on more renewables installations. Going off the Meta details, it would install about 1.5GW of electricity production for a 1GW facility, and have a 200MW connection to ensure 99.99% uptime. After the infrastructure for reliability is in place, it's extremely easy and feasible for a data centre to add a field of solar panels right behind it and use all that power. Gas turbines are very quick to load up and wind down, so could be curtailed during the day and then brought up again at night (with some modest amount of batteries to smooth out the mere minutes it takes to fully load up a turbine). The solar would be piggybacking off existing in-place infrastructure in that case.
Fascinating according to Smith its absolutely critical we have 9 referendum questions on things that are largely out of her jurisdiction, but sadly no room at all for questions related to renewables, coal or data farms. Oh yeah and about those 'pristine views' that prohibit renewable development, funny how that gigantic loud water sucking data farm isnt such an eye sore.
She's completely right. Wind farms are totally uneconomic, and it's much more difficult to export electricity than data.
While data centres are overbuilt right now, they aren't going away. With oil and gas exports impeded by excessive regulation, something that can benefit from cheap energy and be exported with optical fibre is just the thing.
If Newfoundland had had data centres, the Churchill Falls electricity discussion would look very different.
It's private investment though. Who cares how private folks spend their own money.
Danielle Smith is living in 1950. Oil and gas are not the future. Fresh water is going to be a crisis sooner than later. Renewable energy is the future. She's worried about the view, but wants coal mines on the eastern slopes. Pick a lane. Who would invest in a new pipeline when independence might scuttle its construction? Who would drop a cent into Alberta right now, when a collection of backwards-thinking fools are whining that being the richest province in the country isn't enough, and think they should go it alone? And then they think the bible-thumpers in the US will treat them better? Naive is an understatement. And that's after 40 years of court cases to see who gets what in the breakup. Blackmail is rarely a good idea. Alberta is going backwards at full speed.
I’m thinking you have no idea what you’re talking about but you’re certainly entitled to your opinion.
That's fine. Could you please explain why?
Energy is prosperity, it’s not going anywhere. If you don’t want Canadian energy, where companies have made amazing changes to reduce and even eliminate their impact on the environment, that energy will have to come from somewhere else. You may not like where that is. Alberta takes its responsibilities seriously no matter what you’ve heard wherever you are. You also can’t run an economy on renewables, that isn’t possible at this time if ever.
As to the data centres, that genie isn’t going back into the bottle. The pearl clutching needs to stop. What we need is less opinion and more information so we can take informed decisions.
Fossil fuel burning is also the death of humanity. And there are ways to have energy that don't destroy the planet. China is leading on that. The rest of the world is daily proving that you can run an economy on renewables. Solar in the Sahara could power Europe. We could be leading, but backwards thinking, like Danielle's, looks at today and ignores tomorrow. There is no future for Danielle's grandchildren.
IMHO, data centres are like social media. We did a hell of a lot better without them. AI could be fabulous, but humanity will fuck it up...as it's already doing. I have yet to hear a single case as to why data centres are critical to anything. That they are destroying communities and the environment while feeding wealth to oligarchs is beyond doubt.
What are you talking about, Data centres are the future and Alberta has abundant Natural Gas to fuel them. This is a win win, using a product internally, that the rest of Canada wants us to abandon to energize the future which is AI data centres.
Future of what? We need RI far more than AI. How are you going to cool them? Hell, you could power them with solar farms with a little forethought, but that won't be happening, it appears.
Are you insane, do you have ANY idea how much energy is required for AI to work, Solar will never be able to meet that demand, it would be equivalent to using Dial up internet! Since you appear to be a climate catastrophist and clearly dont understand the physics of energy I dont feel the need to further engage.
Petend climate change isn't a crisis for as long as you can.
https://seia.org/blog/ai-leaders-are-pumping-billions-into-solar-storage/
You might want to take a quick peek at just how much land you would need to cover with solar arrays to provide the energy requirements of a high density data centre.... plus of course, all the batteries one would require to provide power the OTHER two thirds of the time (when the sun isn't shining)
And the cattle can merrily graze underneath them.
Meanwhile Alberta is attracting more real investment, not just words to gullible boomers, than the rest of Canada combined.
If this is scaring away investment then bring more of it
Seems like religious slurs are irrelevant and unnecessary when talking about energy policy, but I guess that's par for the course among federalists.
If you're looking for "toe-in-the-water" hesitancy, tune in "Ottawa" on your radio dial. If you want progress, watch Danielle Smith.
Make no mistake the Billions of dollars for these data centres do not end up in Alberta or Canada.
While we may benefit short term from construction there is no residual buy of technology.
There is the inherent risk of closure, and quickly, leaving taxpayers on the hook for a site 75% the size of Airdrie.
Smith can’t or won’t get the current energy industry to clean up after itself why would we expect this to be any different.
Failure and radicalization are the two dominant forces in Smith’s life.
Them smelly gas things won't ever better me horse.
I see this all the time. Why does everything have to become a tool for Whataboutery? Why can't you just take the win - especially when wins are rare - and feel good about it? This is literally like a kid getting an A in math being scolded for not getting an A in everything else. Why can't people just celebrate the damn win? What's wrong if Alberta becomes a powerhouse in Data centers infrastructure? Just please stop with the Whataboutery especially when you have a concrete win to point to.
I’m more optimistic. You’re dealing with free enterprisers who have their shareholders’ money at stake rather than pusillanimous pearl clutching civil servants and politicians worried about suburban Karens’ reaction to any impact on property values.
They are all expecting that various governments will bail them out if things go south because they will have become "too big to fail".
I don’t like wind farms and they done make sense in AB.
I’m upset about Smith unilaterally changing Alberta to central standard time after the province voted against it. It’s caused a ton of scheduling issues for me that I’m going to have to deal with repeatedly and that’s ignoring the fact that we will all be living with a clock that isn’t aligned with the actual light signals that we get from the sun. BC is in the same boat pretending they’re in mountain standard time. People won’t realize how much of a pain it is until it happens and they have to change their entire calendars if they work with people in other time zones. All the sudden a 9-5 calendar will become a 10-6 calendar for part of the year which messes with family routines. And meanwhile we’ll be waking up in the dark and still finishing work in the dark. Less daylight to see for everyone who works in an office. It’s really bad and I’m surprised there’s not more people talking about it.
Daylight Savings Time. We stay at “Spring Ahead” time. I don’t like it either. It’s ok,no one’s listening
They should’ve at least been honest and said they were moving Bc to mountain standard and Alberta to central standard time year round. Instead of these hogwash “staying in bc daylight and mountain daylight” nonsense.
And, thank goodness for that! Wind farms are a drain on our economics, Data centres will be a boost to us economically. I would hazard a guess that long term the data centres are better for the environment than the wind farms as well. All, Data centers are the future whether we like it or not, and canada is very well positioned to capitalize on the financial opportunities they represent just based on our northern geographic location.
I don’t know tons about data centres but I do know a lot of people have a lot of opinions, informed or not, about them.
Alberta is well situated to accommodate many of them, we certainly have the energy to power them, we have the land mass on which to build them, all we need is information and actual knowledge about them to allay the fears.
The politics aside, I doubt the Alberta Data centre, and a good many others, will ever be completed. This is a repeat of the dot-com boom or the rail bust of the 1920s. Massive overbuilding of infrastructure that cannot be sustained by the demand and revenue it requires. (It is only this year that some companies' stock prices returned to what they were 26 years ago.
This time, I suspect it will be much worse than previous events, more money, more companies
People fear that which they do not understand, and in a democracy even morons have a vote.
If the "folks" had a veto on every project people wanted to do on their own land, we would still be living in caves as a species.
Democracy isn't great, we just don't have a better alternative.
The part of the discussion that seems to be missed is that little of the production of the equipment for windmills, solar panels nor data centres will occur in North America, let alone Canada or Alberta. The vast majority of the capital equipment spend will be in Asia or Europe.
While the output of renewable energy can be measured, and presumably levies charged by governments, I am curious as to how it is, beyond initial construction, a few operations jobs and property taxes, that data centres will contribute to a local or regional economy?
And when they inevitably wear out is the a replacement or refurbishment requirement, or do they become the abandoned eyesores of the 2070s?
Most assured,they’ll be eyesores. Recently have been travelling by truck across Alberta,Northwards. Section after section after section of land has been cleared of trees. Sawmills,OSB mills ect. So much is being left bare. I’ve walked these sections and not one tree has been replanted,even after 5-10 years since logging. I guess it all looks ok for the government employees from their office screens. Who inspects and insures that the work is complete? Gravel pits? Old oil and gas wells?
Please do not ignore relevant public - read voter - experience. Realizing that renewables can't produce during severe winter weather made a deep impression on voters. Hence, there is subsequent support for limiting renewable because voters need a stable grid that is not a patch up. Recent experience trumps words from various causes, past or present.
Meanwhile, the data centre plans came at a time when the media was stoking worry that AI will reduce good paying jobs and use too much water. The left grasped those straws, attempting to make political hay.
The modern data centres planned for Alberta use closed loop cooling systems and also use air from Alberta's cold winters. Those 2 options were not available to last decade's data centres in places like Arizona, from which the media and the left are drawing information.
The UCP did a poor communications job of the roll out - one wonders if they bothered to do polls - and is now in catch up mode. But there's a lot of positives related to data centres, including long term well paying jobs. Data centre location issues are fixable. The data centres are building their own electricity plants. I can't wait to see how this situation pans out.
Renewable energy sources do not pay government any royalties even though currently oil royalties are paid in bitumin not dollars. Nice for the oil companies and a pathetic payback for the province getting its own natural resources back as payment. Somehow support for oil has been propogandized into loyalty to Alberta and breaking that ideological roadblock isn't easy
I'm coming late, but I remember Matt Gurney talking nearly a year ago about a loss of subject matter experts in the news industry (this was in response to a Jason Kenney tweet, which was in response to a CTV news article talking about S.33 that was very poorly researched). In that same way, I am begging Rob Breakenridge to actually TALK to industry about renewables in Alberta, instead of regurgitating the same thing repeated by multiple writers before him or getting information from Pembina Institute. The province installed about 75% of renewables in the entire country from 2020 to 2026, and now the big bottleneck is that Alberta needs to actually be able to hook projects onto the grid. Big electrical infrastructure is at a huge bottleneck and years-long wait times.
Unironically, data centres would help spur on more renewables installations. Going off the Meta details, it would install about 1.5GW of electricity production for a 1GW facility, and have a 200MW connection to ensure 99.99% uptime. After the infrastructure for reliability is in place, it's extremely easy and feasible for a data centre to add a field of solar panels right behind it and use all that power. Gas turbines are very quick to load up and wind down, so could be curtailed during the day and then brought up again at night (with some modest amount of batteries to smooth out the mere minutes it takes to fully load up a turbine). The solar would be piggybacking off existing in-place infrastructure in that case.
Fascinating according to Smith its absolutely critical we have 9 referendum questions on things that are largely out of her jurisdiction, but sadly no room at all for questions related to renewables, coal or data farms. Oh yeah and about those 'pristine views' that prohibit renewable development, funny how that gigantic loud water sucking data farm isnt such an eye sore.