This is an interesting solution. However, no matter what instructions you give the police are going to find themselves in all kinds situations that are unforeseeable and will not have clear ministerial direction. Maybe some sort of "serious incident" review panel is required too?
I'm against this rodeo. I think the selfish actions of those involved are reckless and dangerous. That being said, before intervening, I would ask myself certain questions:
Would having RCMP in Alberta acting on the orders of a minster from Toronto risk galvanizing this group?
Is it constitutional for the police to intervene on private property to stop it?
Would at least a substantial minority of the people attending this rodeo refuse to comply with police orders to disperse?
What are the the risks that police intervention devolves into some sort of standoff or has other unforseen consequences?
I think the risks of an intervention on such a large crowd outweighed the benefits in this particular circumstance. That such an event can take place is, in part, certainly due to the failings of leadership.
This following the logic of the original article that the RCMP will now going to report directly to a government minister. The minister would be the Minister of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness. That ministry is currently occupied by the Honourable Bill Blair of Scarborough Southwest.
No it says Minster Madu (of Alberta) should make public the law enforcement protocol for enforcing public health orders during this pandemic. The police force enforcing the protocol, would in the case of the rodeo, be the RCMP, who have the responsibility of enforcing provincial laws in Alberta, in locations not covered by municipal police forces.
It doesn't have anything to do with Bill Blair, the Federal minister.
That's a good point, I misread that 5th paragraph and don't have good knowledge on the relationships governing law enforcement.
I think the original point remains that such a directive could result in that forcing the RCMP into a standoff type situation or have other unforeseen consequences. Even if it is easier to hold an Albertan minister accountable, I don't think it would be likely to result in the desired outcome.
They do more or less the same here in SK, maybe slightly more diligent. Still, what's the value of a ticket after an event that spreads COVID? I expect it's to be a deterrent but it may also be an motivating action. Regardless, the point of not spreading disease is not helped much by tickets after the event.
I like the SK government's statement that fines not paid will be garnished from wages.
I laughed at the fact that, apparently, there were people at the recent Saskatoon anti-mask gathering who posed in groups waving their tickets and saying they'll fight the charges.
This situation is exactly where the current government wants it: to talk tough, do the minimum and obscure it all in a fog so that Kenney/Shandro/Madu can talk out of both sides of their mouth. Only when it is to their political advantage to replace talk with action will they then do so. Until then, it's more political theatre than administrative action.
Of all people, a lawyer must be aware of the Constitution and that it was written to protect the rights of the people from the over reach of the Government. Unfortunately I am in no way surprised, as we have seen the complete disregard of our Constitution continually over the last six years with no support, no words of denunciation from few, if any lawyers or judges. The very ones who should be speaking up, remain silent or denounce those most harmed by the actions of our Government as they walk all over the very Constitution put in place to protect the people. I have never seen restrictions placed on the citizens of Canada where they can no longer open their businesses to which the money they makes puts food upon their tables. Through no fault of their own they have been financially devastated while being denounced if they protest. They are ticketed, arrested at times, and fined for daring to speak out. Not so long ago we had protesters holding this entire country hostage as our supply chain grinded to a halt. They were allowed to create havoc, destroy personal property, and endanger lives. Yet nothing was done, few if any charges laid, as Canada's entire economy was held hostage by a handful of people. Canada has an emergency measures act to which all Provinces and the Federal Government met to produce a set standard and actions to respond to any emergency, even a pandemic. Yet when this pandemic came the Federal Government ignored the plan and took direction from a China led WHO. Yes and here we are today. Meanwhile the Government, media, and now the public denounce those who stand against these heavy handed actions and demand justice for spreading a virus that was allowed into the country by our Governments inaction. While three jumbo jets land in Calgary full of infected people be it today, tomorrow as they continually land, you choose to blame, shame, denounced and demand those standing against Government over reach be jailed and punished. Well I believe we will have to be looking in the mirror at our selves for sometime to come because the hypocrisy is over flowing. The lawyers, Government employees, Financial services, and the elites of this society who can work from home have not felt any harm from the Government over reach and the decimation of our rights and freedoms. Not one bit. Of course they want shutdowns, as it does not effect them personally, they still receive full pay and have not felt the bite of loosing everything they worked to build. I am vulnerable to this virus, so I stay home with little contact, as I believe any vulnerable person should do. The shuttering of the entire economy is insanity and if people truly want to blame and point fingers, start with the Federal Government in Ottawa, then move to the Provincial Governments as the fault is theirs and theirs alone.
"It recommended that ministers provide clear, written and public directions on how policing should take place."
Is there any document from a minister anywhere in the country that even remotely satisfies this recommendation? On any topic?
This is an interesting solution. However, no matter what instructions you give the police are going to find themselves in all kinds situations that are unforeseeable and will not have clear ministerial direction. Maybe some sort of "serious incident" review panel is required too?
I'm against this rodeo. I think the selfish actions of those involved are reckless and dangerous. That being said, before intervening, I would ask myself certain questions:
Would having RCMP in Alberta acting on the orders of a minster from Toronto risk galvanizing this group?
Is it constitutional for the police to intervene on private property to stop it?
Would at least a substantial minority of the people attending this rodeo refuse to comply with police orders to disperse?
What are the the risks that police intervention devolves into some sort of standoff or has other unforseen consequences?
I think the risks of an intervention on such a large crowd outweighed the benefits in this particular circumstance. That such an event can take place is, in part, certainly due to the failings of leadership.
Toronto? The RCMP in Alberta are responsible to the Alberta Solicitor General.
This following the logic of the original article that the RCMP will now going to report directly to a government minister. The minister would be the Minister of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness. That ministry is currently occupied by the Honourable Bill Blair of Scarborough Southwest.
No it says Minster Madu (of Alberta) should make public the law enforcement protocol for enforcing public health orders during this pandemic. The police force enforcing the protocol, would in the case of the rodeo, be the RCMP, who have the responsibility of enforcing provincial laws in Alberta, in locations not covered by municipal police forces.
It doesn't have anything to do with Bill Blair, the Federal minister.
That's a good point, I misread that 5th paragraph and don't have good knowledge on the relationships governing law enforcement.
I think the original point remains that such a directive could result in that forcing the RCMP into a standoff type situation or have other unforeseen consequences. Even if it is easier to hold an Albertan minister accountable, I don't think it would be likely to result in the desired outcome.
Recommendation is good. Trying to politically divert the attention from the topic to what others have and have not done is a waste of space.
They do more or less the same here in SK, maybe slightly more diligent. Still, what's the value of a ticket after an event that spreads COVID? I expect it's to be a deterrent but it may also be an motivating action. Regardless, the point of not spreading disease is not helped much by tickets after the event.
I like the SK government's statement that fines not paid will be garnished from wages.
I laughed at the fact that, apparently, there were people at the recent Saskatoon anti-mask gathering who posed in groups waving their tickets and saying they'll fight the charges.
Thanks for the photo-evidence, folks.
Thank you—I was not aware of this gap. How do we demand this accountability? Are we limited to letters to MLAs?
This situation is exactly where the current government wants it: to talk tough, do the minimum and obscure it all in a fog so that Kenney/Shandro/Madu can talk out of both sides of their mouth. Only when it is to their political advantage to replace talk with action will they then do so. Until then, it's more political theatre than administrative action.
Whether Rail blockades or Rodeos the police do an admiral job.
Take some pictures, issue a few tickets and later arrest the organizers,
well played.
What exactly are you advocating for? Police in riot gear, tear gas, dogs, strip searches, mass arrests?
Keep in mind then, that those tactics would have to also be used at protests with which you agree.
Of all people, a lawyer must be aware of the Constitution and that it was written to protect the rights of the people from the over reach of the Government. Unfortunately I am in no way surprised, as we have seen the complete disregard of our Constitution continually over the last six years with no support, no words of denunciation from few, if any lawyers or judges. The very ones who should be speaking up, remain silent or denounce those most harmed by the actions of our Government as they walk all over the very Constitution put in place to protect the people. I have never seen restrictions placed on the citizens of Canada where they can no longer open their businesses to which the money they makes puts food upon their tables. Through no fault of their own they have been financially devastated while being denounced if they protest. They are ticketed, arrested at times, and fined for daring to speak out. Not so long ago we had protesters holding this entire country hostage as our supply chain grinded to a halt. They were allowed to create havoc, destroy personal property, and endanger lives. Yet nothing was done, few if any charges laid, as Canada's entire economy was held hostage by a handful of people. Canada has an emergency measures act to which all Provinces and the Federal Government met to produce a set standard and actions to respond to any emergency, even a pandemic. Yet when this pandemic came the Federal Government ignored the plan and took direction from a China led WHO. Yes and here we are today. Meanwhile the Government, media, and now the public denounce those who stand against these heavy handed actions and demand justice for spreading a virus that was allowed into the country by our Governments inaction. While three jumbo jets land in Calgary full of infected people be it today, tomorrow as they continually land, you choose to blame, shame, denounced and demand those standing against Government over reach be jailed and punished. Well I believe we will have to be looking in the mirror at our selves for sometime to come because the hypocrisy is over flowing. The lawyers, Government employees, Financial services, and the elites of this society who can work from home have not felt any harm from the Government over reach and the decimation of our rights and freedoms. Not one bit. Of course they want shutdowns, as it does not effect them personally, they still receive full pay and have not felt the bite of loosing everything they worked to build. I am vulnerable to this virus, so I stay home with little contact, as I believe any vulnerable person should do. The shuttering of the entire economy is insanity and if people truly want to blame and point fingers, start with the Federal Government in Ottawa, then move to the Provincial Governments as the fault is theirs and theirs alone.
We see the same pattern of policing whenever people block roads or railways for the cause du jour. It's all very frustrating.