Another comment on the lunch program. I read somewhere that the money is enough for $3.75 per lunch. Someone needs to tell me what quality of lunch you’re going to get when you don’t have the infrastructure in place, shipping, cost, ingredient, cost, etc.
It’s not possible. You are better off increasing the child benefit.
An entertaining and mostly thoughtful discussion as always. I hung in to the end as I was listening on my earbuds while doing spring yard work. Hearing that the IDF is supposedly using AI to approve target strikes was mid blowing and scary. Looking forward to more discussions on the foreign interference hearings. I would be curious in.a future podcast to hear MG a and JG’s thoughts on why David Johnston wrote the report he did and seemingly was so incurious that he failed to talk to many key subjects. All in all a great show.
That being said I’m surprised MG didn’t challenge JG’s statement about how the School Food Programme is great because she hates to make lunches - forgive me if my paraphrase is a little lazy here. That’s the kind of statement that makes folks go bonkers on thiis program, that if it is indeed “universal”, which the funding would indicate is not the case, and if 25% of kids are going hungry (read that stat in some LPC a statement and will take as is), then that means 75% of the programme is just displacing lunches that would have been taken care of by the parents. !!! But I guess if someone hates doing something, then the government should do it! By the way, if you hate making lunches, see if you school can connect up with a Lunch Lady franchise. https://thelunchlady.ca/. Or better yet, maybe give her number to the feds.
Interesting discussion on the Liberals motives for stonewalling investigations of Chinese election interference - Trudeau's thin skin, his narcissism, follow the money, etc., the Liberals' penchant for angry denial of reality, gift for self-delusion, etc. Here is another one - they have been caught red-handed at being epically negligent in "defending our democracy" (to use one of Trudeau's oft-bleated phrases) from foreign interference. Of course, this is the same crew who think that positioning media in a state of dependence on suckling at the government teat, invoking of the Emergency Act, putting forward legislation to imprison people for life for "hate speech", house arrest for those who "might" commit "hate speech", etc.
Whether or not one believes Liberal government actions are protecting our degrading democracy is not, however, the key point. What it comes down to is this - to the Liberals, "defending our democracy" means defending the Liberal Party - there is no distinction between the two in their insular mindset - none. This is but one reason, amongst countless others, why this gaggle of incompetents have to be turfed in the next federal election.
If Jen really wants to rub her temples she will read up on a branch of theology called dispensationalism. You’ll find the the red heifer plus a bunch of other stuff ripped out of context and reassembled into a man made, apocolyptic fantasy. All the best!
May I suggest a book to help Jen understand why the Red Helfer is such a big deal to Hamas and Orthodox Jews? The Bible. Get the details straight from the source.
A red heifer is sacrificed by the preist Eleazar to purify the Israelites as they are released from their 40 years of wilderness wandering and sent into the promised land. See the book of Numbers 19:1-22. This was a command from God for a specific people at a specific time. Read in context of the entire sweep of the biblical account it is clear that the ashes of the red heifer are but a temporary cleansing of God's chosen people, Israel. It is a foreshadowing of the permanent and effective cleansing of God's elect through the blood of Jesus Christ that was still to come.
I don't know who needs to hear the following so I will share this section of Hebrews chapter 9 that explains to the Christians who came out of Judaism why they no longer need to follow the sacrificial law of the Torah to be right with God:
"But when Christ appeared as a high priest of the good things that have come then through the greater and more perfect tent (not made with hands, that is, not of this creation he entered once for all into the holy places, not by means of the blood of goats and calves but by means of his own blood, thus securing an eternal redemption. For if the blood of goats and bulls, and the sprinkling of defiled persons with the ashes of a heifer, sanctify for the purification of the flesh, how much more will the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without blemish to God, purify our conscience from dead works to serve the living God.
Therefore he is the mediator of a new covenant, so that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance, since a death has occurred that redeems them from the transgressions committed under the first covenant."
Yes, we are on a timeline. The Israel/Hamas war is a repeat of the many battles chronicled in the Old Testament between the children of Israel and the people of the nations. It is just one of the times the Dragon has waged war against the offspring of the woman, Israel. See Revelation 12 for a brief history of the world. I don't think the current war specifically is bringing us closer to the end times. I am no theologian so I may be wrong. But I do read my bible.
The event that will wrap up history and bring the second coming of Jesus Christ is when He gathers the last of the elect to Himself. Only God Himself knows who that person is. The job of the Church is to evangelize to the ends of the earth. That last person may be a Hamas fighter, an IDF soldier, somebody named Jen or even Matt. It seems like Richard Dawkins has been praising Christianity lately... maybe he is that last person God wants gathered into His kingdom? Jesus welcomes the most unlikely of people into His kingdom, Dawkins is no further from God than Saul of Tarsus was. The Church just scatters the seeds, the Holy Spirit helps them grow and Christ brings in the harvest.
As a follower of Christ I understand that the evil one is allowed to wreak havoc in this world. But he is fighting a war he will ultimately lose. All who repent of their sins and accept Jesus Christ's sacrifice on the cross for our sins are given the tools needed to fight back and there are only two: the blood of the Lamb and the word of our testimony.
G & G, I appreciate you reporting our world in our human time scale. You help me understand the day to day events as history unfurls. I pray that you each read the bible, understand it and can find peace by finding your places in God's timeline. It will bring order out of the chaos and a peace that surpasses human understanding.
I left all that teaching behind when I decided to walk away from my conservative evangelical faith.
Wow; when I read it now it sounds so far-out-on-a-limb I'm embarrassed. The ideas presented in your comment are interpretations upon interpretations built upon philosophical assumptions.
But hey, if it motivates you to do good things, to be compassionate, and to find peace then carry on. If we happen to meet someday, I hope we can grab a coffee.
I judge religion pretty much solely by the fruits of the tree, at this point. If a religion is leading people to live better, happier lives, and to contribute to their communities -- great. Good religion.
If a set of religious beliefs sets off world war 3...well...that tells me what I need to know. JG
You nailed it on the war. This is what war looks like. Gaza looks like most of Germany and Japan in WW2. I don't think any of this is good for Israel long term. It is an atrocity to the senses. But I have yet to hear anyone say what an appropriate response to October 7 would be. That it may have been caused by 5 cows says all you need to know about organised religion. It's still humanity's worst invention.
Happy Rapture Eve to all who celebrate. ( eyes rolling to an almost painful level)
The school lunch initiative is one of those government programs equivalent to treating yourself out to a fancy dinner on your credit card because you’re stressed out about missing a mortgage payment. Sparing Canadian parents the hassle of having to pack a school lunch for their kids isn’t something the federal government needs to be doing with yawning deficits and underperformance in just about every portfolio they already hold.
I much prefer the approach taken by my local school board in New Westminster: they set up a contract with lunch provider. Parents can order lunches and they’re delivered to the school everyday. Meals are provided for kids in need, partly subsidized by the paid orders. Don’t want the hassle of packing a lunch? No problem- you can pay for it. Enough people use it that there’s no stigma for the kids getting subsidized meals. Personally, we don’t use it much - the kids don’t really like the meals, and they’re expensive compared to the (tastier and healthier) options from home.
We have a trust fund federal government run by a trust fund PM who has decided to spend his way - with tax dollars - to erase the 20 points in the polls, essentially cost is no object because creating wealth to a trust fund recipients has never been an issue! That the Liberals only now realize there is a cost of living “issue” in Canada while millions are renewing their mortgages and having a “come to Jesus” moment with their banker is the definition of out of touch! The only thing the Liberals are effective at is taxing Canadians and they are not very efficient at that either - what’s a few billions in Covid support to their friends after all! The Liberal caucus should fit in minivan after the next federal election for the good of the country!
This week Trudeau will appear before the committee investigating foreign interference. I will bet $100. that nothing will come from this and teflon Trudeau will skate. He will obfuscate, deny any knowledge and will essentially lie through his teeth on the stand. Matt and Jen are worried about being sued by the government for speaking truth to lies, but us lesser mortals are allowed to call out the corruption. Our government is morally bankrupt.
Way to double-down, Mr. Gurney, on your war-mongering support for Israel's "persecution" of the war (nice Freudian slip, btw!). Good to know that it's not just genocide that would be going too far for you but ethnic cleansing, too! Also good to know that you expected all of this, the slaughter of tens of thousands of innocent Palestinian civilians (mostly women and children), the mass starvation of the rest by siege, and the oh no, we did it again targeting (by AI means or otherwise) of protected humanitarian workers, journalists and medical staff. But who are we to judge Israel's conduct from our Canadian armchairs when, as you say, we would do the same if Windsor were attacked by a terrorist group in Michigan. Indeed, your podcast chair is apparently comfortable enough to excuse Israeli war crimes and crimes against humanity because of their different "strategic environment" and the fact that they are exercising some restraint in not doing worse. But that's why we have laws of war, right, those pesky Geneva Conventions that say it's not up to you or NATO or Israel to dictate when crimes against humanity and war crimes suddenly become justifiable. Your realpolitik is not in the least bit as reasonable as you seem to think, rather it is apologism for ongoing war crimes and crimes against humanity the perpetration of which you apparently continue to support.
Matt never said that anything and everything that Israel does in the war is justified. But to whatever extent Israel is committing war crimes, and it is surely committing some, misunderstanding Israel's motivations will not help us to bring those crimes to an end sooner rather than later. That does include understanding the "strategic environment" in which the Israeli mentality has formed, so that we can make persuasive criticisms of Israeli behaviour accordingly.
I would also note that I do not believe that Matt has any objection to the IDF facing charges for war crimes, provided the court is a fair one. Though I would not wish to speak on his behalf. JG
You do a far better job of articulating a realpolitik perspective on this; the difference being, though, that Matt's ends justifies the means premise has to mean just that, simply that until Israel "wins" the war by sufficiently destroying Hamas to its satisfaction then anything less than ethnic cleansing and genocide is justified.
I won't have time to give a full reply before my subscription expires tomorrow, which I am gladly letting lapse given the war-mongering that supposedly passes for reasonable debate in this substack. Matt's flippant reply to my critique above says it all, joking in relation to the slaughter of thousands of children. Not to mention regular racist comments about Palestinians by Kićo Slabinac and NotoriousSceptic's threat below. First, you can't consider the appropriate Israeli response in a vacuum that ignores its participation in the cycle of violence that October 7 is part of, and which Israeli officials are perpetuating with apparent glee. Second, whatever Israel's response is, it should not include the ongoing commission of war crimes and crimes against humanity being perpetrated as official policy, which no "strategic environment" can justify. Third, it should involve the international community in responding appropriately and in taking the necessary steps to prevent the perpetuation of this never-ending cycle of violence, which Netanyahu has already said he will never do despite having no real exit plan at all (see CNN article link below). https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/05/middleeast/gaza-war-no-plan-israel-intl-cmd/index.html
I disagree. I don't think you let the opinions of two people; for that is all this debate really is; opinions, cause you to walk away from something. I think you have to take them on in civil debate; something I have done with both while wanting, at times to bang my head against the wall. We all have our own belief systems. Explaining them can be the hard part. Opinions are backed by facts. I think Matt has done a great job of making it clear that Canada's opinion on what is happening there will be considered irrelevant. I also think it's important to different why what is happening is happening from whether it is a good idea. Which is why I asked you the question of what an appropriate response would be.
I'm aware of the history; the area has basically been a war zone on and off since 1948....and all because who people pray to. It's idiotic in my opinion. That opinion is irrelevant. You are justifying what Hamas did because of the history. This is two sides that have been fighting for 70 years that were in a ceasefire. Hamas clearly had a goal in mind, and they knew Israel would retaliate. Hamas is getting exactly what it asked for. I think the were hoping to perpetuate and Arab uprising. It failed. Tens of thousands will die because of that misjudgement. It will also not make Israel more secure in the long term. I suspect there will be war crimes trials after the war. And if anyone from Hamas who was part of this survives until the end, they will face trial as well.
The International community has no role to play while the war is going on. They couldn't stop Hamas from attacking, and they can't stop Israel from responding. They are doing what they can, and it isn't much. To have peacekeeping, you have to have peace. Neither side currently wants that. The only end to war is one side surrendering without conditions. The US is living proof starting wars with no plan to get out.....until public opinion says it's time to cut and run. They leave a few billion in equipment and leave a massive power vacuum; creating ISIS for example that they're still trying to eradicate.
There are lots of things I don't agree with Jen and Matt about. They have also offered perspectives that I hadn't considered. I consider that far more than worth my $50 investment. Because you get stupid pretty fast living in an echo chamber. FOX watchers and Trump supporters are living proof of that.
I hope you stay. Debate with people you don't agree with is both healthy and mentally challenging.
That was indeed my intention in first subscribing to The Line to expose myself to reasonable enough opinions from a different perspective. What I did not expect was war-mongering. And I certainly have attempted to engage in civil enough debate (you will see many of my past comments on these issues posted in the past 6 months) only to be ignored or responded to by flippant remarks by the editors (and racist and threatening remarks by some of the commentators which the editors have allowed for). Jen did once engage with one of my comments, which I expressed appreciation for at the time.
I take you to be more reasonable, though we disagree. Nowhere did I justify what Hamas did on October 7th, rather I simply pointed out that you need to appreciate the full historical context in determining what an appropriate response by Israel should be.
In any case, while I appreciate your encouragement to stay and debate, as I said, it hasn't been a real debate and I would rather not support a platform that takes such a one-sided view in support of the slaughter of thousands of children as if that could ever be justifiable.
Ah, leading with threats of violence, the resort of those with no other effective means of persuasion. And I'm sure the Gazans would agree with you that Gurney condoning Israel's excesses in the war short of ethnic cleansing and genocide is most thorough, objective and compassionate.
All I can say is well done you two - cojent, reasoned,and well delivered with a few swears thrown in at the appropriate time.
I was going to throw the comment that there isn't the infrastructure in most schools for a hot lunch but you beat me to it.
I would say that if we are actually suggesting that the government should look after our rent, feed our children at school, decide what kind of vehicles we drive, what our farmers can put on their fields to grow the food that feeds us, and so forth. Correct me if I'm wrong but people who start relying on the government for everything is a socialist going to communist system and if we are not careful that is where we are going to find ourselves if we don't turn the country around.
Excellent podcast. Likely the best discussion of the China issue I've heard on Canadian media. Should be required listening.
Israel/Hamas? No arguments, Matt is correct, this is war.
War sucks.
Also see Ukraine. Remember Ukraine?
Eventually we in Canada will learn how war works, up close and personally. As Matt noted, the cycle will come around...and we are on the 💩 end of the cycle heading towards hard times.
School food program:
No argument from me...smart politics for gullible people, but an unattainable policy if administered federally that will be marked by exceptional food waste, menus dominated by nutritionally poor 'comfort food' overdosed with grease/sugar/salt that will only add to our existing obesity/diabetes epidemic, and as you correctly point out, outrageous graft throughout the system, dominated by firms from central Canada. Anyone else remember university 'rezlings' (students in campus residence housings) that added 50lbs a year subsisting on the campus 'foods program'? Yep, guaranteed to be high quality food in Canada's new 'school diabetes starter program'-no student left behind!
I think you have it right that humanity, once comfortable, seeks out the darkness and chaos...like moths to a flame...only we humans set the fire and then move closer to it as it grows until we fall, jump, or get pushed into it.
This lunch program idea was put together by someone who hasn’t recently set foot in a school. The money will go to fund a bunch of bureaucrats and if you actually asked the teachers where the money is best spent they’d tell you it would be nice if we could use the photocopier or the laminator or maybe fund more counsellors to help deal with all of the behavioural issues. There are plenty of outreaches that provide daily food for kids that need it and they even send bags of food home. Maybe just put the money into parents pockets - we don’t need any more bureaucrats
And only adding additional funds for another 400,000 meals a day to be provided.
Here's where the haters kick in with "every kid" and blah, blah, blah.
Kids should not be going to school hungry. Period. Fully believe in that.
But I would suggest that the better solution would be making sure parents have the food they need to make lunches for their own children, not having the federal government take over something that should be so basic to being a parent.
If the federal Federal government want's to introduce a program like this one, they should be putting out numbers. If the numbers are convincing, I might even change my mind:
- How many school age children are there in Canada?
- How many of them are going to school hungry?
- How many of them are benefitting from existing provincial / territorial school meal programs?
-How many of them are going to school hungry after the existing provincial / territorial school meal?
-After adding the Trudeau's promised Billon or so dollars to this initiative, how many more students will remain uncovered, and how many of them need a school lunch program?
- If it costs a household $5.00 - $10.00 (haters, this is just a guess, so, FO) a day to provide lunch for one student, how much more will it cost for the government to provide the same service? (Mat, Gen, got it, you don't like making lung for your kids, but frankly, I don't care.)
Now if a national lunch-making program is Mat's single policy voting issue (Mat, I got your sense of humour when you said that) here is mine. I hate shovelling snow. Perhaps the Federal liberals should announce a policy to deal with that, so that regardless of ones home ownership status, I could count on someone clearing my driveway.
After all, more Canadians die shoveling snow than making lunches for their kids.
Last point. You mentioned this four phase cycle at the very end of the podcast. Never heard of it before, but I found it interesting. If the Feds take over lunch making, I think we are well in deep into the phase of "soft People".
Anyway, sorry for the rant. All the best. Love the weekly podcast and I am looking forward to the next.
Another comment on the lunch program. I read somewhere that the money is enough for $3.75 per lunch. Someone needs to tell me what quality of lunch you’re going to get when you don’t have the infrastructure in place, shipping, cost, ingredient, cost, etc.
It’s not possible. You are better off increasing the child benefit.
An entertaining and mostly thoughtful discussion as always. I hung in to the end as I was listening on my earbuds while doing spring yard work. Hearing that the IDF is supposedly using AI to approve target strikes was mid blowing and scary. Looking forward to more discussions on the foreign interference hearings. I would be curious in.a future podcast to hear MG a and JG’s thoughts on why David Johnston wrote the report he did and seemingly was so incurious that he failed to talk to many key subjects. All in all a great show.
That being said I’m surprised MG didn’t challenge JG’s statement about how the School Food Programme is great because she hates to make lunches - forgive me if my paraphrase is a little lazy here. That’s the kind of statement that makes folks go bonkers on thiis program, that if it is indeed “universal”, which the funding would indicate is not the case, and if 25% of kids are going hungry (read that stat in some LPC a statement and will take as is), then that means 75% of the programme is just displacing lunches that would have been taken care of by the parents. !!! But I guess if someone hates doing something, then the government should do it! By the way, if you hate making lunches, see if you school can connect up with a Lunch Lady franchise. https://thelunchlady.ca/. Or better yet, maybe give her number to the feds.
Yeah to be clear, I think a hypothetical universal school lunch program could be a good idea. JG
Where JT has been before the ethics commish a few times it’s not a real stretch to question his ethics on interference ,
Interesting discussion on the Liberals motives for stonewalling investigations of Chinese election interference - Trudeau's thin skin, his narcissism, follow the money, etc., the Liberals' penchant for angry denial of reality, gift for self-delusion, etc. Here is another one - they have been caught red-handed at being epically negligent in "defending our democracy" (to use one of Trudeau's oft-bleated phrases) from foreign interference. Of course, this is the same crew who think that positioning media in a state of dependence on suckling at the government teat, invoking of the Emergency Act, putting forward legislation to imprison people for life for "hate speech", house arrest for those who "might" commit "hate speech", etc.
Whether or not one believes Liberal government actions are protecting our degrading democracy is not, however, the key point. What it comes down to is this - to the Liberals, "defending our democracy" means defending the Liberal Party - there is no distinction between the two in their insular mindset - none. This is but one reason, amongst countless others, why this gaggle of incompetents have to be turfed in the next federal election.
If Jen really wants to rub her temples she will read up on a branch of theology called dispensationalism. You’ll find the the red heifer plus a bunch of other stuff ripped out of context and reassembled into a man made, apocolyptic fantasy. All the best!
Sounds fun! JG
UPDATE: That's absolutely ahistoric nuts! JG
May I suggest a book to help Jen understand why the Red Helfer is such a big deal to Hamas and Orthodox Jews? The Bible. Get the details straight from the source.
A red heifer is sacrificed by the preist Eleazar to purify the Israelites as they are released from their 40 years of wilderness wandering and sent into the promised land. See the book of Numbers 19:1-22. This was a command from God for a specific people at a specific time. Read in context of the entire sweep of the biblical account it is clear that the ashes of the red heifer are but a temporary cleansing of God's chosen people, Israel. It is a foreshadowing of the permanent and effective cleansing of God's elect through the blood of Jesus Christ that was still to come.
I don't know who needs to hear the following so I will share this section of Hebrews chapter 9 that explains to the Christians who came out of Judaism why they no longer need to follow the sacrificial law of the Torah to be right with God:
"But when Christ appeared as a high priest of the good things that have come then through the greater and more perfect tent (not made with hands, that is, not of this creation he entered once for all into the holy places, not by means of the blood of goats and calves but by means of his own blood, thus securing an eternal redemption. For if the blood of goats and bulls, and the sprinkling of defiled persons with the ashes of a heifer, sanctify for the purification of the flesh, how much more will the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without blemish to God, purify our conscience from dead works to serve the living God.
Therefore he is the mediator of a new covenant, so that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance, since a death has occurred that redeems them from the transgressions committed under the first covenant."
Yes, we are on a timeline. The Israel/Hamas war is a repeat of the many battles chronicled in the Old Testament between the children of Israel and the people of the nations. It is just one of the times the Dragon has waged war against the offspring of the woman, Israel. See Revelation 12 for a brief history of the world. I don't think the current war specifically is bringing us closer to the end times. I am no theologian so I may be wrong. But I do read my bible.
The event that will wrap up history and bring the second coming of Jesus Christ is when He gathers the last of the elect to Himself. Only God Himself knows who that person is. The job of the Church is to evangelize to the ends of the earth. That last person may be a Hamas fighter, an IDF soldier, somebody named Jen or even Matt. It seems like Richard Dawkins has been praising Christianity lately... maybe he is that last person God wants gathered into His kingdom? Jesus welcomes the most unlikely of people into His kingdom, Dawkins is no further from God than Saul of Tarsus was. The Church just scatters the seeds, the Holy Spirit helps them grow and Christ brings in the harvest.
As a follower of Christ I understand that the evil one is allowed to wreak havoc in this world. But he is fighting a war he will ultimately lose. All who repent of their sins and accept Jesus Christ's sacrifice on the cross for our sins are given the tools needed to fight back and there are only two: the blood of the Lamb and the word of our testimony.
G & G, I appreciate you reporting our world in our human time scale. You help me understand the day to day events as history unfurls. I pray that you each read the bible, understand it and can find peace by finding your places in God's timeline. It will bring order out of the chaos and a peace that surpasses human understanding.
😇 😇
I left all that teaching behind when I decided to walk away from my conservative evangelical faith.
Wow; when I read it now it sounds so far-out-on-a-limb I'm embarrassed. The ideas presented in your comment are interpretations upon interpretations built upon philosophical assumptions.
But hey, if it motivates you to do good things, to be compassionate, and to find peace then carry on. If we happen to meet someday, I hope we can grab a coffee.
I judge religion pretty much solely by the fruits of the tree, at this point. If a religion is leading people to live better, happier lives, and to contribute to their communities -- great. Good religion.
If a set of religious beliefs sets off world war 3...well...that tells me what I need to know. JG
You nailed it on the war. This is what war looks like. Gaza looks like most of Germany and Japan in WW2. I don't think any of this is good for Israel long term. It is an atrocity to the senses. But I have yet to hear anyone say what an appropriate response to October 7 would be. That it may have been caused by 5 cows says all you need to know about organised religion. It's still humanity's worst invention.
Happy Rapture Eve to all who celebrate. ( eyes rolling to an almost painful level)
The school lunch initiative is one of those government programs equivalent to treating yourself out to a fancy dinner on your credit card because you’re stressed out about missing a mortgage payment. Sparing Canadian parents the hassle of having to pack a school lunch for their kids isn’t something the federal government needs to be doing with yawning deficits and underperformance in just about every portfolio they already hold.
I much prefer the approach taken by my local school board in New Westminster: they set up a contract with lunch provider. Parents can order lunches and they’re delivered to the school everyday. Meals are provided for kids in need, partly subsidized by the paid orders. Don’t want the hassle of packing a lunch? No problem- you can pay for it. Enough people use it that there’s no stigma for the kids getting subsidized meals. Personally, we don’t use it much - the kids don’t really like the meals, and they’re expensive compared to the (tastier and healthier) options from home.
We have a trust fund federal government run by a trust fund PM who has decided to spend his way - with tax dollars - to erase the 20 points in the polls, essentially cost is no object because creating wealth to a trust fund recipients has never been an issue! That the Liberals only now realize there is a cost of living “issue” in Canada while millions are renewing their mortgages and having a “come to Jesus” moment with their banker is the definition of out of touch! The only thing the Liberals are effective at is taxing Canadians and they are not very efficient at that either - what’s a few billions in Covid support to their friends after all! The Liberal caucus should fit in minivan after the next federal election for the good of the country!
This week Trudeau will appear before the committee investigating foreign interference. I will bet $100. that nothing will come from this and teflon Trudeau will skate. He will obfuscate, deny any knowledge and will essentially lie through his teeth on the stand. Matt and Jen are worried about being sued by the government for speaking truth to lies, but us lesser mortals are allowed to call out the corruption. Our government is morally bankrupt.
Way to double-down, Mr. Gurney, on your war-mongering support for Israel's "persecution" of the war (nice Freudian slip, btw!). Good to know that it's not just genocide that would be going too far for you but ethnic cleansing, too! Also good to know that you expected all of this, the slaughter of tens of thousands of innocent Palestinian civilians (mostly women and children), the mass starvation of the rest by siege, and the oh no, we did it again targeting (by AI means or otherwise) of protected humanitarian workers, journalists and medical staff. But who are we to judge Israel's conduct from our Canadian armchairs when, as you say, we would do the same if Windsor were attacked by a terrorist group in Michigan. Indeed, your podcast chair is apparently comfortable enough to excuse Israeli war crimes and crimes against humanity because of their different "strategic environment" and the fact that they are exercising some restraint in not doing worse. But that's why we have laws of war, right, those pesky Geneva Conventions that say it's not up to you or NATO or Israel to dictate when crimes against humanity and war crimes suddenly become justifiable. Your realpolitik is not in the least bit as reasonable as you seem to think, rather it is apologism for ongoing war crimes and crimes against humanity the perpetration of which you apparently continue to support.
I’m glad you enjoyed it.
Matt never said that anything and everything that Israel does in the war is justified. But to whatever extent Israel is committing war crimes, and it is surely committing some, misunderstanding Israel's motivations will not help us to bring those crimes to an end sooner rather than later. That does include understanding the "strategic environment" in which the Israeli mentality has formed, so that we can make persuasive criticisms of Israeli behaviour accordingly.
I would also note that I do not believe that Matt has any objection to the IDF facing charges for war crimes, provided the court is a fair one. Though I would not wish to speak on his behalf. JG
You do a far better job of articulating a realpolitik perspective on this; the difference being, though, that Matt's ends justifies the means premise has to mean just that, simply that until Israel "wins" the war by sufficiently destroying Hamas to its satisfaction then anything less than ethnic cleansing and genocide is justified.
I'm curious what you think an appropriate response from Israel would have been to October 7.
I won't have time to give a full reply before my subscription expires tomorrow, which I am gladly letting lapse given the war-mongering that supposedly passes for reasonable debate in this substack. Matt's flippant reply to my critique above says it all, joking in relation to the slaughter of thousands of children. Not to mention regular racist comments about Palestinians by Kićo Slabinac and NotoriousSceptic's threat below. First, you can't consider the appropriate Israeli response in a vacuum that ignores its participation in the cycle of violence that October 7 is part of, and which Israeli officials are perpetuating with apparent glee. Second, whatever Israel's response is, it should not include the ongoing commission of war crimes and crimes against humanity being perpetrated as official policy, which no "strategic environment" can justify. Third, it should involve the international community in responding appropriately and in taking the necessary steps to prevent the perpetuation of this never-ending cycle of violence, which Netanyahu has already said he will never do despite having no real exit plan at all (see CNN article link below). https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/05/middleeast/gaza-war-no-plan-israel-intl-cmd/index.html
Thanks for subscribing. JG
I disagree. I don't think you let the opinions of two people; for that is all this debate really is; opinions, cause you to walk away from something. I think you have to take them on in civil debate; something I have done with both while wanting, at times to bang my head against the wall. We all have our own belief systems. Explaining them can be the hard part. Opinions are backed by facts. I think Matt has done a great job of making it clear that Canada's opinion on what is happening there will be considered irrelevant. I also think it's important to different why what is happening is happening from whether it is a good idea. Which is why I asked you the question of what an appropriate response would be.
I'm aware of the history; the area has basically been a war zone on and off since 1948....and all because who people pray to. It's idiotic in my opinion. That opinion is irrelevant. You are justifying what Hamas did because of the history. This is two sides that have been fighting for 70 years that were in a ceasefire. Hamas clearly had a goal in mind, and they knew Israel would retaliate. Hamas is getting exactly what it asked for. I think the were hoping to perpetuate and Arab uprising. It failed. Tens of thousands will die because of that misjudgement. It will also not make Israel more secure in the long term. I suspect there will be war crimes trials after the war. And if anyone from Hamas who was part of this survives until the end, they will face trial as well.
The International community has no role to play while the war is going on. They couldn't stop Hamas from attacking, and they can't stop Israel from responding. They are doing what they can, and it isn't much. To have peacekeeping, you have to have peace. Neither side currently wants that. The only end to war is one side surrendering without conditions. The US is living proof starting wars with no plan to get out.....until public opinion says it's time to cut and run. They leave a few billion in equipment and leave a massive power vacuum; creating ISIS for example that they're still trying to eradicate.
There are lots of things I don't agree with Jen and Matt about. They have also offered perspectives that I hadn't considered. I consider that far more than worth my $50 investment. Because you get stupid pretty fast living in an echo chamber. FOX watchers and Trump supporters are living proof of that.
I hope you stay. Debate with people you don't agree with is both healthy and mentally challenging.
Cheers
That was indeed my intention in first subscribing to The Line to expose myself to reasonable enough opinions from a different perspective. What I did not expect was war-mongering. And I certainly have attempted to engage in civil enough debate (you will see many of my past comments on these issues posted in the past 6 months) only to be ignored or responded to by flippant remarks by the editors (and racist and threatening remarks by some of the commentators which the editors have allowed for). Jen did once engage with one of my comments, which I expressed appreciation for at the time.
I take you to be more reasonable, though we disagree. Nowhere did I justify what Hamas did on October 7th, rather I simply pointed out that you need to appreciate the full historical context in determining what an appropriate response by Israel should be.
In any case, while I appreciate your encouragement to stay and debate, as I said, it hasn't been a real debate and I would rather not support a platform that takes such a one-sided view in support of the slaughter of thousands of children as if that could ever be justifiable.
Thanks for trying us out. Good luck.
Ah, leading with threats of violence, the resort of those with no other effective means of persuasion. And I'm sure the Gazans would agree with you that Gurney condoning Israel's excesses in the war short of ethnic cleansing and genocide is most thorough, objective and compassionate.
All I can say is well done you two - cojent, reasoned,and well delivered with a few swears thrown in at the appropriate time.
I was going to throw the comment that there isn't the infrastructure in most schools for a hot lunch but you beat me to it.
I would say that if we are actually suggesting that the government should look after our rent, feed our children at school, decide what kind of vehicles we drive, what our farmers can put on their fields to grow the food that feeds us, and so forth. Correct me if I'm wrong but people who start relying on the government for everything is a socialist going to communist system and if we are not careful that is where we are going to find ourselves if we don't turn the country around.
Excellent podcast. Likely the best discussion of the China issue I've heard on Canadian media. Should be required listening.
Israel/Hamas? No arguments, Matt is correct, this is war.
War sucks.
Also see Ukraine. Remember Ukraine?
Eventually we in Canada will learn how war works, up close and personally. As Matt noted, the cycle will come around...and we are on the 💩 end of the cycle heading towards hard times.
School food program:
No argument from me...smart politics for gullible people, but an unattainable policy if administered federally that will be marked by exceptional food waste, menus dominated by nutritionally poor 'comfort food' overdosed with grease/sugar/salt that will only add to our existing obesity/diabetes epidemic, and as you correctly point out, outrageous graft throughout the system, dominated by firms from central Canada. Anyone else remember university 'rezlings' (students in campus residence housings) that added 50lbs a year subsisting on the campus 'foods program'? Yep, guaranteed to be high quality food in Canada's new 'school diabetes starter program'-no student left behind!
I think you have it right that humanity, once comfortable, seeks out the darkness and chaos...like moths to a flame...only we humans set the fire and then move closer to it as it grows until we fall, jump, or get pushed into it.
Oh, happy day! Like & subscribe!
We're curious about chaos because we haven't seen true chaos. There's totally a shadow in the soul - why else would true crime be so popular?
This lunch program idea was put together by someone who hasn’t recently set foot in a school. The money will go to fund a bunch of bureaucrats and if you actually asked the teachers where the money is best spent they’d tell you it would be nice if we could use the photocopier or the laminator or maybe fund more counsellors to help deal with all of the behavioural issues. There are plenty of outreaches that provide daily food for kids that need it and they even send bags of food home. Maybe just put the money into parents pockets - we don’t need any more bureaucrats
Hi Jen, Mat and Mat's wife.
This is tongue in cheek, but I am not going to be using any emojis.
I don't think the Trudeau announced a "Universal" free lunch program. If I am reading this (https://www.pm.gc.ca/en/news/news-releases/2024/04/01/national-school-food-program-set-kids-success) properly, he's just tossing a BILLION or so dollars at something the provinces have all been doing. For years now.
And only adding additional funds for another 400,000 meals a day to be provided.
Here's where the haters kick in with "every kid" and blah, blah, blah.
Kids should not be going to school hungry. Period. Fully believe in that.
But I would suggest that the better solution would be making sure parents have the food they need to make lunches for their own children, not having the federal government take over something that should be so basic to being a parent.
If the federal Federal government want's to introduce a program like this one, they should be putting out numbers. If the numbers are convincing, I might even change my mind:
- How many school age children are there in Canada?
- How many of them are going to school hungry?
- How many of them are benefitting from existing provincial / territorial school meal programs?
-How many of them are going to school hungry after the existing provincial / territorial school meal?
-After adding the Trudeau's promised Billon or so dollars to this initiative, how many more students will remain uncovered, and how many of them need a school lunch program?
- If it costs a household $5.00 - $10.00 (haters, this is just a guess, so, FO) a day to provide lunch for one student, how much more will it cost for the government to provide the same service? (Mat, Gen, got it, you don't like making lung for your kids, but frankly, I don't care.)
Now if a national lunch-making program is Mat's single policy voting issue (Mat, I got your sense of humour when you said that) here is mine. I hate shovelling snow. Perhaps the Federal liberals should announce a policy to deal with that, so that regardless of ones home ownership status, I could count on someone clearing my driveway.
After all, more Canadians die shoveling snow than making lunches for their kids.
Last point. You mentioned this four phase cycle at the very end of the podcast. Never heard of it before, but I found it interesting. If the Feds take over lunch making, I think we are well in deep into the phase of "soft People".
Anyway, sorry for the rant. All the best. Love the weekly podcast and I am looking forward to the next.